Steve Jobs - The Lost Interview (11 May 2012) [VO] [ST-FR] [Ultra HD 4K]

SUMMARY

In a rediscovered 1995 interview, Steve Jobs speaks candidly with Robert X. Cringely about his early fascination with computers, founding Apple, key innovations like the Macintosh, corporate challenges, and the transformative potential of technology at the intersection of art and engineering.

STATEMENTS

Steve Jobs first encountered computers at age 10 or 11 through a time-sharing terminal at NASA's Ames Research Center, sparking a lifelong passion.
At 12, Jobs cold-called Hewlett-Packard co-founder Bill Hewlett for parts to build a frequency counter, leading to a summer job that shaped his view of company culture.
Hewlett-Packard treated employees exceptionally well, recognizing their value through small gestures like daily coffee and donut breaks, influencing Jobs's early business perspective.
Jobs met Steve Wozniak around age 14 or 15, bonding over electronics and inspired by an Esquire article on phone phreaking with Captain Crunch.
Jobs and Wozniak built blue boxes to make free phone calls by mimicking AT&T's signaling tones, teaching them they could control vast infrastructure with simple devices.
The blue box project demonstrated that young innovators could build something small to influence giant systems, a lesson foundational to creating Apple.
Necessity drove the shift to personal computers; Jobs and Wozniak built a terminal for free time-sharing access, evolving it into the Apple I.
The Apple I was assembled by hand in Jobs's garage using scavenged parts, taking 40 to 80 hours each, initially for personal use.
Friends wanted Apple I kits but lacked assembly skills, so Jobs and Wozniak created printed circuit boards, selling them to regain time and costs.
Jobs sold his Volkswagen bus and Wozniak his calculator to fund the first Apple circuit boards, marking their entry into business.
The Byte Shop's owner ordered 50 assembled Apple I boards, forcing Jobs and Wozniak to learn electronics distribution and secure net-30 credit for parts.
After selling the first 50 units, their profit was tied up in 50 more unsold computers, prompting nationwide distribution to other stores.
Mike Markkula joined as a key partner after investing and committing personally, enabling the Apple II's packaging and production.
The Apple II aimed to appeal to software hobbyists by being fully packaged, unlike hobbyist kits, targeting a thousand times more users.
At the 1977 West Coast Computer Faire, the Apple II's color graphics stole the show, attracting dealers and launching widespread adoption.
Jobs learned business by persistently questioning "why" practices exist, uncovering folklore and inefficiencies like standard costing in manufacturing.
Programming teaches structured thinking, akin to law school, making computer science a liberal art everyone should learn for intellectual growth.
Jobs became a millionaire at 23, $10 million at 24, and $100 million at 25, but money was secondary to building impactful products and company culture.
Visiting Xerox PARC in 1979, Jobs was mesmerized by the graphical user interface, recognizing its inevitable dominance in computing.
Xerox failed to commercialize PARC innovations because sales and marketing executives, or "toner heads," overpowered product visionaries in monopolistic structures.
IBM's entry into PCs was scary for Apple, but IBM's genius was creating vested interests among partners, improving their initially poor product.
Implementing Xerox's GUI ideas at Apple required overriding skeptical engineers from Hewlett-Packard backgrounds, who dismissed concepts like the mouse.
Companies falter by institutionalizing processes over content, confusing management rituals for innovation, as seen in IBM's decline.
The Macintosh project reinvention included an automated factory, cheaper components, and a $1,000 price target, saving Apple from obsolescence.
Great products emerge from craftsmanship bridging ideas to reality, involving daily trade-offs in design, materials, and engineering.
Teams of passionate A-players polish ideas through friction, like rocks in a tumbler, creating exceptional outcomes beyond individual efforts.
In software and hardware, the gap between average and best is 50-to-1 or more, so success relies on assembling top talent who self-select.
Jobs fired underperformers directly but constructively, focusing on work quality to maintain team standards without ego-stroking.
Apple pioneered desktop publishing by integrating the first Canon laser printer with Adobe software, dominating the printer market briefly.
Jobs's departure from Apple in 1985 stemmed from clashing with CEO John Sculley during a recession, where survival instincts led to his ousting.
Apple's post-Jobs stagnation eroded its 10-year lead, with billions in R&D yielding minimal innovation due to leadership vacuum.
Microsoft succeeded through opportunism and persistence, leveraging IBM's platform, but lacks taste, producing uninspired products without cultural depth.
NeXT focuses on object-oriented software, enabling 10x faster development, positioning it as a key enabler in an increasingly software-driven world.
The web fulfills computing's shift from calculation to communication, democratizing commerce and innovation beyond Microsoft's control.
Humans amplify abilities with tools like the bicycle, and computers rank as the ultimate invention, with early nudges shaping future trajectories.
Taste guides innovation by stealing from the best human arts, blending liberal arts perspectives with technical excellence in product design.
Jobs identifies as a hippie, valuing a quest for deeper meaning beyond materialism, infusing products with spirit that users sense and love.

IDEAS

Encountering a computer as a child felt like a privilege, transforming abstract mystery into tangible execution of ideas.
Calling a CEO at 12 for parts not only succeeded but opened doors to corporate worlds, showing boldness yields opportunity.
Blue boxing revealed hidden vulnerabilities in global infrastructure, empowering amateurs to hack billion-dollar systems.
Personal computers arose from practical needs, like building affordable terminals, evolving into self-contained revolutionary devices.
Selling cars and calculators to fund prototypes illustrates bootstrapping innovation without external capital.
Assembling computers by hand for friends highlighted the gap between technical skill and market demand for ready solutions.
Venture partners like Markkula brought not just money but operational expertise, accelerating from garage to market.
Questioning business "folklore" uncovers inefficiencies, allowing rapid learning without formal training.
Programming mirrors thought processes, teaching logic and abstraction more profoundly than practical applications alone.
Wealth accumulation was incidental; true drive lay in enabling human creativity through products.
Xerox PARC's GUI demo blinded Jobs to other innovations, underscoring how paradigm shifts eclipse surroundings.
Monopolies rot from within as sales overpowers product vision, turning innovators into sidelined "toner heads."
IBM's ecosystem strategy turned a flawed product into dominance, proving alliances amplify weaknesses.
Skeptical hires from established firms resist disruption, requiring decisive overrides to implement visions.
Process institutionalization confuses means for ends, stifling content-driven innovation in scaling companies.
Macintosh saved Apple by reinventing every aspect, from automation to pricing, proving agility trumps legacy.
Product design juggles thousands of variables daily, where trade-offs and discoveries forge magic.
Team friction, like rock tumbling, polishes raw ideas into gems through passionate collaboration.
Talent disparities in tech are extreme, creating self-reinforcing A-player cultures that propel excellence.
Direct feedback on work, detached from personal egos, sustains high standards in elite teams.
Desktop publishing emerged serendipitously from printer integration, transforming industries overnight.
CEO survival instincts during crises scapegoat visionaries, fracturing companies amid economic pressure.
Stagnant R&D in leaderless firms wastes billions, eroding leads to inevitable decline.
Microsoft's persistence turned opportunistic leaps into market control, but without soul or originality.
Object-oriented tech revolutionizes software creation, multiplying speed and quality in a software-saturated future.
The web equalizes small and large entities, shifting commerce to direct, global channels.
Bicycles exemplify tool amplification; computers extend this to intellect, ranking as humanity's pinnacle invention.
Stealing great ideas shamelessly, infused with liberal arts, elevates tech beyond narrow engineering.
Hippie ethos seeks transcendent meaning, channeling it into products that resonate emotionally.
Computers as mediums transmit personal visions, attracting creators who might otherwise pursue arts.
Early vector nudges in emerging tech yield exponential societal impacts over time.

INSIGHTS

Childhood access to rare technology ignites profound curiosity, laying foundations for lifelong innovation.
Bold, direct outreach to authority figures unlocks unforeseen mentorship and opportunities.
Hacking systems teaches asymmetric power: small inventions can command vast infrastructures.
Bootstrapping from personal assets fosters resilience and authentic problem-solving.
Market gaps between builders and users drive commercialization, turning hobbies into businesses.
External expertise transforms viable ideas into scalable products without diluting vision.
Persistent inquiry dismantles outdated practices, enabling faster mastery of complex fields.
Learning to code cultivates disciplined thinking, enriching cognitive frameworks universally.
Financial success pales against creating tools that empower human potential.
Revolutionary interfaces render prior paradigms obsolete, demanding immediate adaptation.
Corporate monopolies prioritize sales over innovation, eroding the genius that built them.
Strategic partnerships compensate for internal flaws, turning threats into triumphs.
Inherited mindsets resist disruption; visionary leadership must bypass them decisively.
Overemphasizing processes over substance leads to bureaucratic stagnation and failure.
Holistic reinvention across operations revives endangered enterprises through bold execution.
Iterative craftsmanship amid constraints births products through relentless refinement.
Collaborative tension among elites refines ideas into extraordinary outcomes.
Extreme talent variances necessitate curating top performers for outsized results.
Candid, work-focused critique maintains excellence without undermining confidence.
Integrating hardware and software serendipitously spawns industry-defining applications.
Crises expose leadership voids, where self-preservation trumps collective vision.
Absent direction, even massive investments yield minimal progress, hastening obsolescence.
Opportunistic endurance, backed by revenue, builds empires, though lacking aesthetic depth.
Advanced paradigms like objects accelerate creation, fueling software's societal dominance.
Communication over computation defines computing's evolution, amplified by open platforms.
Tools exponentially enhance innate abilities; computers crown this legacy.
Cultivating taste through diverse arts infuses technology with humanistic depth.
Transcendent quests infuse creations with spirit, fostering deep user connections.
Tech as expressive medium draws interdisciplinary talents, enriching innovation.

QUOTES

"It was an incredibly thrilling experience um so I became very um captivated by by a computer."
"We could build something ourselves that could control billions of dollars worth of infrastructure in the world."
"If you're willing to sort of ask a lot of questions and think about things and work really hard you you can learn business pretty fast."
"I think everybody in this country should learn how to program a computer should learn a computer language because it teaches you how to think."
"The most important thing was the company the people the products we were making what we were going to enable people to do with these products."
"Within you know 10 minutes it was obvious to me that all computers would work like this someday it was it was obvious."
"The product sensibility and the the product gen genus that brought them to to that monopolistic position gets rotted out by people running these companies who have no conception of a good product."
"Designing a product is keeping 5,000 things in your brain these Concepts and fit fitting them all together."
"It's through the team through that group of incredibly talented people bumping up against each other having arguments having fights sometimes making some noise and working together they polish each other."
"In software and it used to be the case in Hardware too the difference between average and the best is 50 to one maybe 100 to one easy."
"The most important thing I think you can do for somebody who's really good and who's really being counted on is to point out to them when um they're not their work isn't good enough."
"I don't really care about being right you know I just care about success."
"They just have no taste they have absolutely no taste and and and what that means is I don't mean that in a small way I mean that in a big way."
"Software is becoming an incredible force in this world um to provide new goods and services to people."
"The web is going to be the defining technology the defining social uh um the defining social moment for computer."
"The personal computer was the bicycle of the mind and I believe that with every bone in my body."
"Good artists copy great artists steal."
"There's something more going on there's another side of the coin that we don't talk about much."

HABITS

Persistently asking "why" to uncover the rationale behind business practices and inefficiencies.
Cold-calling experts or leaders directly to seek advice, parts, or opportunities without intermediaries.
Scavenging and hand-assembling prototypes in a garage to prototype ideas affordably.
Forming small, mission-driven teams of top talent for intense, focused projects.
Visiting global factories and suppliers to learn cutting-edge manufacturing techniques.
Providing direct, work-specific feedback to team members to elevate performance standards.
Stealing and integrating great ideas from diverse fields like art, music, and history into tech.
Surrounding oneself exclusively with A-players to create self-reinforcing excellence.
Reflecting on personal experiences, like childhood tools, to draw metaphors for innovation.
Maintaining emotional detachment from money, prioritizing product impact over wealth.
Brooding briefly on setbacks before pivoting to new missions or reinventions.
Exposing oneself to liberal arts and humanities to cultivate taste in design.
Seeking transcendent meaning beyond materialism to infuse spirit into work.
Iteratively refining ideas through daily trade-offs and discoveries in design.
Collaborating with interdisciplinary experts to blend creativity with technical skill.

FACTS

Jobs got a summer job at Hewlett-Packard at age 12 after cold-calling Bill Hewlett.
Jobs and Wozniak built the world's best digital blue box for free phone calls in three weeks.
The Apple I took 40 to 80 hours to assemble by hand using scavenged parts.
Jobs sold his Volkswagen bus for $1,500 to fund Apple circuit boards.
Apple II debuted at the 1977 West Coast Computer Faire with the first color graphics on a PC.
Jobs was worth over $100 million by age 25 after Apple's IPO.
Xerox PARC networked over 100 Alto computers with email in 1979.
Macintosh mouse was engineered in 90 days for $15 by an external firm.
Apple built the world's first automated computer factory in California for Macintosh.
Jobs bought 19.9% of Adobe to secure PostScript for LaserWriter printers.
Apple became the world's largest printer company by revenue when Jobs left in 1985.
IBM was a $30 billion company when entering PCs, dwarfing Apple's $1 billion valuation.
Macintosh line changed only 25% from 1985 to 1995 despite billions in R&D.
NeXT had about 300 employees and $50-75 million revenue in 1995.
Humans on bicycles outperform condors in locomotion efficiency per kilocalorie.

REFERENCES

Triumph of the Nerds television series by Robert X. Cringely.
NASA Ames Research Center time-sharing terminal.
Hewlett-Packard 9100 desktop computer.
Esquire magazine article on Captain Crunch and phone phreaking.
AT&T technical journal from Stanford Linear Accelerator Center library.
Byte Shop computer store in Mountain View.
West Coast Computer Faire 1977.
Xerox Palo Alto Research Center (PARC) innovations: graphical user interface, object-oriented programming, networked Altos.
PepsiCo as John Sculley's prior company.
Scientific American article on locomotion efficiency.
Bill Atkinson quote on critiquing work.
David Kelley design firm for Macintosh mouse.
Canon laser printer engine.
Adobe PostScript software and 19.9% stake.
Macintosh Office announcement in 1985.
NeXT object-oriented software platform.
World Wide Web and Internet as emerging technologies.
Picasso's saying: "Good artists copy, great artists steal."

HOW TO APPLY

Start with personal curiosity: Access early computing resources like terminals to experiment and execute ideas.
Build boldness: Cold-call experts for parts or advice to gain entry into professional networks.
Form key partnerships: Bond with skilled collaborators like Wozniak over shared interests in electronics.
Prototype necessities: Design and build tools, like terminals, to solve immediate access problems.
Scavenge resources: Use available parts and sell personal assets to fund initial production runs.
Create accessible kits: Develop printed circuit boards to simplify assembly for non-experts.
Secure small orders: Pitch to local stores like the Byte Shop to validate demand and learn assembly.
Negotiate credit: Convince suppliers for net-30 terms to bootstrap without upfront capital.
Expand distribution: Call nationwide stores to sell excess inventory and realize profits.
Recruit investor-operators: Seek partners like Markkula who invest time and money equally.
Package for masses: Design fully assembled products to target software hobbyists over hardware builders.
Demo boldly: Showcase innovations like Apple II graphics at fairs to attract dealers.

ONE-SENTENCE TAKEAWAY

Steve Jobs's journey reveals that blending bold curiosity, elite teams, and humanistic taste propels technology toward amplifying human potential.

RECOMMENDATIONS

Learn programming early to sharpen logical thinking, treating it as essential liberal arts education.
Question every business practice deeply to eliminate folklore and innovate efficiently.
Assemble only A-players for projects, as their synergy creates exponential value.
Override skeptics decisively when pursuing visionary ideas like graphical interfaces.
Reinvent holistically during crises, from manufacturing to marketing, to revive companies.
Provide direct feedback on work quality to sustain elite performance without ego involvement.
Integrate hardware and software partnerships, like with Adobe, for breakthrough applications.
Steal shamelessly from arts and humanities to infuse products with cultural depth.
Focus on craftsmanship's trade-offs to bridge ideas and real-world products.
Nudge emerging tech vectors early, as small changes yield massive future impacts.
Seek transcendent purpose in work to create products with emotional resonance.
Democratize innovation via open platforms like the web to foster widespread creativity.
Prioritize content over process to avoid the pitfalls of scaling bureaucracies.
Leverage alliances to amplify strengths, turning potential failures into successes.
Cultivate taste through diverse exposures to elevate technology beyond functionality.
Bootstrap with personal resources before seeking external funding.
Use metaphors from life, like rock tumbling, to inspire collaborative team dynamics.
Persist opportunistically, as Microsoft did, but add original spirit.
Pioneer automation and cost reductions to make advanced tech accessible.
Reflect on tool-building history to appreciate computing's role in human amplification.

MEMO

In 1995, as the personal computing revolution reshaped the world, Steve Jobs sat for a rare, unfiltered interview with journalist Robert X. Cringely, part of the PBS series Triumph of the Nerds. This "lost" conversation, rediscovered years later, captures Jobs at a pivotal moment—ousted from Apple a decade earlier, leading the boutique software firm NeXT, and presciently diagnosing the tech landscape. At 40, Jobs reflected on his improbable path from a 12-year-old calling Hewlett-Packard for parts to co-founding a company that democratized computing. His early thrill with a teletype terminal at NASA's Ames Research Center ignited a fascination with machines that "execute your idea," a spark that evolved into the Apple I, hand-built in his garage with friend Steve Wozniak.

Jobs and Wozniak's teenage escapades with "blue boxes"—devices hacking AT&T's phone network for free calls—taught a profound lesson: two kids could command billions in infrastructure. This audacity birthed Apple, starting with a terminal for free computing time, morphing into the Apple I kit sold to hobbyists. Bootstrapping with Jobs's Volkswagen bus and Wozniak's calculator, they pivoted to assembled boards after a Byte Shop order, navigating credit terms and distribution calls. By 1977, the Apple II, packaged for everyday users with color graphics, dazzled at the West Coast Computer Faire, propelling Apple to billions and Jobs to millionaire status by 23. Yet, he dismissed wealth's allure, fixated on products enabling creativity.

The Xerox PARC visit in 1979 was Jobs's epiphany: a flawed graphical user interface foretold computing's future, blinding him to networked systems nearby. Xerox's "toner heads"—sales execs from its copier monopoly—squandered this goldmine, a cautionary tale of how dominance erodes innovation. Apple, too, stumbled; hiring Hewlett-Packard veterans resistant to mice and fonts, Jobs bypassed them, engineering a $15 mouse in 90 days. Institutionalizing processes over "content" nearly doomed the Lisa project, mismatched at $10,000 for Apple's audience. Exiled to lead Macintosh, Jobs's "mission from God" team reinvented everything: an automated factory, slashed chip costs, and a $2,500 machine that saved the company.

Crafting hits like the Mac demanded juggling 5,000 variables—electrons, plastics, trade-offs—in daily discoveries. Jobs likened elite teams to a rock tumbler: friction among passionate A-players polishes ideas into gems. In tech's 50-to-1 talent chasm, he hired musicians and poets alongside engineers, stealing from Picasso to infuse spirit. Direct critiques honed work without coddling egos; he changed minds swiftly for success. Desktop publishing emerged from Apple's LaserWriter and Adobe PostScript pact, crowning it the top printer firm briefly. But CEO John Sculley's Pepsi-honed survival instincts scapegoated Jobs during 1984's recession, fracturing their alliance and paralyzing Apple.

By 1995, Jobs lamented Apple's "glide path to death": a 10-year lead squandered, billions in R&D yielding scant evolution as Microsoft clawed parity. He credited Microsoft's IBM-fueled opportunism and persistence but decried its tasteless, "McDonald's" products lacking enlightenment. NeXT, with 300 souls, championed object-oriented software for 10x faster creation, poised for a software-saturated era. Peering ahead, Jobs hailed the web as computing's social pivot—from calculation to communication—equalizing commerce, where catalogs yield to direct sales and minnows rival giants.

Underlying Jobs's drive was humanism: a Scientific American piece on bicycles outpacing condors symbolized tools amplifying abilities, computers the "bicycle of the mind." Taste, drawn from liberal arts, guided nudges in this nascent vector. Identifying as a "hippie," he sought life's deeper "inrush" beyond materialism, channeling it into Macs users "loved" for their soul. Computers, he insisted, mirrored thought and transmitted visions, drawing creators who'd otherwise pen poetry. This lost interview, raw with charisma, honors Jobs's legacy: at art-technology's crossroads, he nudged humanity toward flourishing.

Though NeXT's acquisition would soon reclaim Apple, revitalizing it with OS X, 1995's Jobs foresaw software's potency in wars like MCI's billing edge over AT&T. His ouster exposed leadership's fragility, yet resilience defined him—brooding briefly before pivoting. Apple's values, he warned, were systematically eroded, differentiation lost to pedestrian rivals. Yet optimism flickered: the web's innovation, untethered from monopolies, promised renewal.

Ultimately, Jobs's narrative underscores technology's role in human elevation. From garage hacks to global vectors, his insights—on teams, taste, and transcendence—remain blueprints for builders. In an industry prone to folklore and drift, he urged content over process, passion over pedigree, ensuring tools not just compute but inspire.